Michael Seifert, CEO of the values-aligned marketplace called PublicSq, joins the podcast this week to talk about company boycotts and the importance of consumer alternatives. In light of the decisions by Target, Bud Light, and other companies who have gone woke, many are asking, “where do I shop?” This is where PublicSq enters the conversation. Michael and Beverly talk about the massive growth they’ve experienced, how the marketplace works, and what it tells us about doing business in America.
Michael Seifert is the CEO & Founder at PublicSq, a digital marketplace designed to connect values-aligned businesses with consumers. PublicSq is currently the largest directory of freedom-loving businesses in America. Prior to starting PublicSq, Michael was the Director of Marketing and Public Relations at Pacifica Enterprises, Inc.
TRANSCRIPT
Beverly Hallberg:
And welcome to She Thinks, a podcast where you’re allowed to think for yourself. I’m your host, Beverly Hallberg, and on today’s episode, Michael Seifert, CEO of the Values aligned Marketplace called Public Square, joins us to talk about company boycotts and the importance of consumer alternatives in light of the decisions by Target, Bud Light and other companies who’ve gone woke. Many are asking “Where do I shop?” And this is where Public Square can help. Michael and I talk about the massive growth they’ve experienced, how the marketplace works, and what it tells us about doing business in America. Before we jump into the conversation a little bit more about Michael, Michael Siefert is the CEO and founder at Public Square Digital Marketplace, designed to connect values aligned businesses with consumers. Public Square is currently the largest directory of freedom loving businesses in America. And prior to starting Public Square, he was the director of Marketing and Public Relations at Pacifica Enterprises. Michael, a pleasure to have you on, she thinks today.
Michael Seifert:
Thanks so much for having me. It’s an honor to be here,
Beverly Hallberg:
And I’m sure this has been a rollercoaster of a ride for you. You have seen massive growth since Public Square started, what, about two years ago, I believe. Tell us a little bit about the inception of this idea.
Michael Seifert:
Well, thanks for asking. It has been a wild two years to say the least. And in fact, it’s especially been a last wild last 12 months because we actually launched nationwide July 4th, 2022. So mostly, all the growth we’ve experienced has really been since then, which actually means that we hit a million membership accounts, for example, faster than even Twitter. So it’s, it’s been a lot. But that said, it’s been really rewarding because it’s a sign that there are millions of Americans out there just like us, that are waking up to realize that we need a parallel economy. We need an economy where we can shop with the blessed assurance that we’re not funding companies that are standing antithetical to the values that have built this nation. I originally had the idea for this company in January of 2021 after witnessing a decade of corporate entities turn against me and my family’s values.
My family is more conservative, we’re more traditionally minded about issues a across the spectrum, both politically and culturally. And it’s been hard to watch Target, Nike, Adidas, Apple, Spotify, Shopify, Airbnb, Lululemon, I mean, you name the company, it’s likely that they’ve really gone quote-unquote woke. They’re donating to progressive causes, they’re advertising to 5% of the country that loves that hyper progressive nonsense, and we’re not really for it. So when these companies become more of like progressive political organizations than they are just quality companies, it left us searching for alternatives. In January, my wife and I got a piece of paper we wrote on it, a list of businesses that we knew we could feel confident supporting. And at that time it was the heart of Covid. And so we were also looking for businesses that would honor our constitutional freedoms that wouldn’t force us to make medical decisions we weren’t comfortable with.
And so we had this list on this piece of paper, we started sharing it with some friends and put it in some Facebook groups, etc. And we learned pretty quickly that maybe there’s actually a hunger for this list across the country. And what if everyone had this list and they could actually utilize it for their own communities and businesses could add themselves to the list by agreeing with sort of our core principles. That was January of 2021. In the last 29, 30 months, we’ve experienced massive growth where the world’s largest marketplace of its kind, but it all started with that initial hunger for a solution, and we’re really grateful that that hunger clearly resonated with a lot of other Americans as well.
Beverly Hallberg:
Well, let’s get into some of the specifics of the marketplace. So people can go on the website, public sq.com. There is also the app, and I believe that this is, was it the second most popular app right now on Apple? So a ton of growth that you’ve seen there. How does it work? How you do, how do you find these businesses? How many members do you have? Give us kind of the nuts and bolts.
Michael Seifert:
Yes. So we have over 55,000 different business vendors on the platform. And the way that works is that business will actually add themselves to the platform by agreeing to respect our five core values of the company. And then once they agree to respect those values, meaning they’re not gonna spend time, money, or resource antagonistically against those values, they agree with them and they’re going to respect them in the marketplace. Once they do that, they also check a box that says that they are committing to making or sourcing as many of their products from the United States as possible. Once that happens, they’re passed off to a vetting team. We have an amazing team of vetters that conduct research and analysis to make sure that these businesses are high in quality and don’t stand against the core values of our company and their public expression and their company materials and their statements on their site, etc.
Then they’re live on the platform. What happens on the consumer side is if you’re interested in shopping your values with this incredible vetted network of over 55,000 different brands, you sign up for [email protected] or download the app. We’ll never ask you for money. We’re never going to charge you to utilize the service. It is absolutely free to create an account to browse. And if you’re looking for a bank, healthcare companies, clothing, jewelry, accessories, outdoor gear, household cleaning products, we even have a toilet paper company. So if you’re looking to replace Charmin, you can do [email protected]. And it’s pretty amazing too, given that these brands from these myriad of different industries have all surfaced within really the last year. And it’s great to know that just like there’s a hunger on the consumer side to spend money in alignment with your values, there’s also a hunger on the business side because they’re seeing an opportunity here. Target has completely abused the values of their consumers. So if you’re a business that offers alternatives to some of the brands that you’ll find in Target right now is your time to shine. Because if you love the country, the constitution, the values, it protects and you’re never gonna lecture your consumers about ideology when they’re trying to just buy toilet paper. Like, now is your time, step into the arena, showcase your products to a group of consumers that have felt unaddressed for far too long. And you get to do [email protected]
Beverly Hallberg:
And you have this motto, it’s called put purpose behind every purchase. A good slogan, I think an important one. And one of the things I’ve wondered with this, I do think that when you see what Target did with having these transgender clothing items that children can wear, you had the transgender influencer, Dylan Mulvaney promoting Bud Light with his face on a can of Bud Light. We’ve seen the market share of these businesses just tank. I believe Bud Light was number one for quite a while as the most popular beer in America. It’s now tied with other beers just complete devastation for this company. But I think as a consumer myself, it’s what I’m looking for often is just, I just don’t want the woke stuff. So how do you determine if the businesses that we have purchased from, is it always going to be that they’re going to align with something, let’s say pro-family, which I think is great if they do, but what about for people they just don’t want woke? Is this a place that embraces those businesses as well?
Michael Seifert:
Well, the apart from certainly attracts people that are obviously driven by that mission statement to put purpose behind the purchase and to be a marketplace that is pro-life, pro-family, and pro-free in nature. We also have the businesses that say, “Hey, look, I, I’ve never really considered myself super political or culturally active, but I can tell you that like what Target’s doing, I absolutely disagree with it, will you have me?” And our simple question is, do you disagree with any of these core values? If you don’t and you agree with these, absolutely, you’re welcome. And I think that speaks to a reality of our platform. We’re far more about the principles that guide us than the political element. And we, I remember in the early days when we were just live in San Diego, California where we launched, we were just conducting a regional roll rollout. And there was a local restaurant owner that reached out and she said, “Hey, look I actually come from a total Democrat background. I’m not conservative. I’ve thought of myself more liberal over the years, but the last few years of Covid have really changed my thinking around certain things. And I’m kind of on a journey and I’m wanting to figure it out. But I definitely generally agree with these values. Like, would you have me?” And we said, absolutely we’d love for you to join. Well, what’s happened in the process is that her restaurant has actually prospered and she’s actually on many of the values that we espouse and the messaging of our company. She’s actually become quite an activist for those things and very well known in our community for really being a leader in terms of personal liberties and advancing, you know, that sort of pro-family message around the country. So it’s interesting, people come at this from a political angle. Other people are very principled and they just love the marketplace that has a sense of patriotism to it.
We have people from country music, action sports, cultural entertainment, people from all over the spectrum that come and join us because they just say they feel more hope here. They feel more optimistic about the future of our country in our marketplace. And so whether you’re waving a bunch of American flags out the door, or you’re just trying to provide quality products that are not going to lecture about your politics, like you’re gonna find the myriad of businesses here all across that spectrum. But you’ll know with a blessed assurance, you’re not funding the woke. That’s just not happening here.
Beverly Hallberg:
And you have a really neat feature on there, and I just wanna read some of these examples. It’s telling people what to buy and what to ditch. For example, you have Ditch Crest buy Smile Sciences, ditch Blue Shield buy American First Healthcare, ditch Levi’s buy Origin, obviously super helpful for people to know where not to go and where to shop if they have the same values as Public Square. Have the companies that you’ve said to ditch reached out to you? What has been the backlash been like from companies that don’t make the cut?
Michael Seifert:
That’s a great question. We have not yet received feedback from the businesses we’re encouraging folks to ditch, although I’ll tell you what, we have hired many of their formerly disgruntled employees that were tired of the woke stuff. So without getting into too many details, obviously, because I want this trend to continue, we’ve had many folks from Target, from Yelp actually leave and come and join our team because they’re saying, I’m just tired of these environments that prioritize woke nonsense over competition, innovation, providing quality products. We’re not able to innovate anymore. So we’re done and we’re coming and joining Public Square. So we have not received a ton of feedback from these companies yet but we have received their disgruntled employees that are ready for something new. And on top of that, you know, the hate that we get from journalists, we’ve had the hit pieces written about us, we’ve had the mean things said about us online, we received the threats.
I mean, all that happens at, you know, to us corporately, or to me individually, but at the end of the day, it only motivates us because I know that that’s the minority of the population. The vast majority of Americans are tired of the hyper politicization of the marketplace and they like the message that we’re espousing here. They want a marketplace that just centers around two things, love for country and love for the values protected by the Constitution past that the only thing that matters is providing quality products. Because ultimately that’s the only way we’ll win. And so anytime we’ve received pushback, those days when the hit pieces are released tend to be the days of greatest growth for us. So we welcome it with open arms.
Beverly Hallberg:
And I would love to get into the psyche of the consumer. So there have been plenty of companies over the years that have promoted things like Pride Month, what was it specifically about this moment in time? And I think Target was a real turning point. What made customers say no more?
Michael Seifert:
I actually have a pretty simple answer to that. I think you could go back a few decades and look at the powder cake that’s been building, and there are a lot of macroeconomic points that we could talk about, and I’m happy to get into some more of those. But there was one thing more than anything that pushed it over the edge. And it’s the fact that these brands started targeting kids. I think a lot of people have a sort of live and let live mentality, you know, that we’re, we’re generally okay with other people’s choice of lifestyle, but the minute you start trying to impose that lifestyle on children, especially when it’s sexual in nature, like absolutely not. And Target’s an interesting case study because that tucking underwear for children and the swimsuits that they were selling going after the children in that way woke up the Mama Bears and actually Target’s primary audience were those moms that now felt very disgruntled and offended that this mega corporation would try to indoctrinate their kids in this manner.
And so I really think it was the kids that pushed things over the edge. Obviously Dylan Mulvaney as well, he’s a young dude, and so he has that sort of affinity with the next generation on the progressive side. And so when Bud Light put him on the can, I think that really spoke volumes to the moms in our country to realize like, wow, they’re really targeting the next generation with this type of messaging and they’re not gonna stand for it. So similar to during the covid period when the lockdown started to affect the mental health of the children in the schools, it drove the moms to these school board meetings to stand up. I think the same thing is happening economically when it was just about adults engaging in adult behavior and the kids were separated from that. There was a sense of sort of apathy or a lack of real concern for that type of messaging.
It just didn’t drive people to the point of frustration to the same degree when the kids started getting involved. And you see that companies are donating to the Trevor Project and highly progressive organizations that try to indoctrinate kids in schools toward progressive gender ideology. A lot of consumers just said, enough is enough, we’re done. And thankfully they can come to our marketplace and know that we are pro-family. We’re not going to impose these types of ideologies on your children. And that’s given them a sense of trust and satisfaction in a marketplace like ours.
Beverly Hallberg:
And I also see that there has just been a change, I think, in bravery. So as you mentioned during the covid years, you had Mama Bears, you had fathers speak up at school board meetings, countering what the schools were doing and not fearing what the repercussions may be to them, because so often people are fearful, especially talking about trans issues because there’s so much negativity from the trans community. If you say anything at all that differs from them. One of the things I think that is great about the boycotts is people are able to speak up, but they can do it with their dollars and still remain anonymous in a certain way as well. It’s, it’s this collective approach to show where people really are on this issue. I’ve been encouraged to see the boycotts have encouraged to even see the growth of our company because people, whether they feel like they can say it out loud or not feel, feel safe enough to do that, they feel safe enough to move their dollars where they matter.
Michael Seifert:
Yeah, I couldn’t agree more. I think the bravery and courage I’ve seen espoused by millions of consumers over the past two months is really exciting and it’s invigorating about the future on a more macroeconomic point as well, I think Americans are tired of being put last by our politicians, by corporate America, by the establishment generally. You know, you’re seeing a real rebuke of anything establishment these days, whether it be corporate media like Fox, CNN, some of these different networks. You’re seeing a drive toward Twitter, right? Even Tucker Carlson’s the most recent example of that. And look, Fox has been good to us and they host us on their shows, and I certainly appreciate that. But at the same time, there’s obviously a writing on the wall that’s taking place where you know corporate media is diminishing in numbers and alternative media sources like Twitter, Rumble, some of these different platforms are really elevating.
And then I think you carry that into companies too. There’s a real rebuke of these major corporate multinational entities that have pushed their views on us for far too long. And there’s a real embrace of small businesses and businesses that aren’t gonna actually about this stuff. Over 90% of the businesses on our platform, for example, are small businesses. They make less than 30 million a year. They’re not funded by big banks. Jamie Diamond with Chase has not given them some sort of loan. Like these are businesses that really prioritize the quality of their products and serving their community well above an ESG score. And that’s really refreshing for consumers. So I am seeing an emboldened attitude out of average Americans that are just saying, we’re tired. We’ve had enough, we’re done. Pride month is nauseating. We cannot do this anymore.
Like the fact that the White House would fly the trans flag in between the American flags breaking us flag code, the fact that all these companies would change their logos in the month of June, it just feels like too much when you wanted to just push for marriage or whatever, like, whatever. But now, like the fact that you’re trying to indoctrinate this all across corporate America, you know, we could have had differing views in the past. Now you’ve tried to completely indoctrinate my family and enough is enough. And they’re thankfully learning that if you wanna change the power structures of society back toward the values of we the people, the best way that you can do that is by speaking with your wallet.
Beverly Hallberg:
And I wanna talk about small businesses. I’m glad you brought that up in talking about how many small businesses are part of this Covid decimated so many small businesses during that time, and we’ve always thought of small businesses as being a backbone of America. You gave one example earlier, but if a small business who aligns with the values of Public Square, if they join your platform, what can they tend to see from a beneficial standpoint? Is this gonna be bolstering small businesses as well?
Michael Seifert:
Absolutely. In fact, I think it’s the thing that we’re best at as we look at the corporate American landscape today. You nailed it. Small businesses have been forgotten. In fact, during Covid, they were deemed non-essential. You were allowed to go into the Walmart or the liquor store because they had the money to lobby government. You weren’t allowed to go though into your mom and pop hardware store down the street. They were forced to close. Your church was forced to, forced to close. Certainly, you know, the, the abuse of individual liberties over the last three years have left literally hundreds of thousands of small businesses around the country never able to reopen anymore. And so there’s a need more than ever to support those folks. And by coming to Public Square we have seen massive success stories across the board testimonies that pile in the dozens every single day of small businesses reaching out, saying that this platform has fundamentally changed in a positive way, their ability to reach a group of hungry consumers.
So whether it’s the coffee shop that doubled their profits in their first month on the platform with us, or the hair salon that made enough new clientele in one week from public square customers to make up for her entire year. Whether it’s that or whether it’s the brewery out of Nashville that fundamentally was able to see an entire new audience devote themselves as regulars, or it’s the creators like the photographer that reached out and said that she finally is getting to find trustworthy leads for all of her different wedding shoots, and she got to pray for a couple because they have the same faith and their values aligned. Like those, those stories keep us going. And what’s neat too is that not only is this an amazing liberating market experience, it’s a lucrative one too. These businesses are actually moving their advertising spend from Google and Facebook and some of these different platforms to Public Square because they’re recognizing that their reach is far greater here because you’ve solidified trust as the fundamental element of the transaction and that that leads to conversions like nothing else can. So even from just a purely economic perspective, this parallel economy is the right way to go.
Beverly Hallberg:
And I wanna talk about another way that you have just supported where your dollars go. Obviously you had to develop this platform, you’ve had to put money into it to make it work, to help other people spend their money. Well, but you’ve have made a decision recently on whether or not you should give public squares tax dollars to a state you disagree with. You moved recently from California to Florida. Tell us about that move and how much money has it saved you?
Michael Seifert:
Well, that’s a great question. We are political refugees out of the state of California to the sunny sunshine freedom state of Florida. And it was bittersweet California’s home and you know, we still have a few team, team members that are there. We’re kind of making the move gradually. But I’m taking this interview from Florida. Our executive team is here, we’re building our office here right now. So we’re in the early days of the move, certainly, but we announced this about six weeks ago, and it will save us a lot over the long run. I mean, realistically we can expect annual savings around 15% just by this locational move, not counting all of the different lessening of burdens on the regulatory side. I mean, obviously we’re going public as a company in California. They make life very hard for publicly traded companies, especially ones that don’t have positive ESG scores.
And having an ESG score is the last thing on my mind. And so California ultimately was facing an expiration date for companies like ours. And it’s sad too because, you know, the Golden State used to be one that incentivized businesses to come out west. And sadly, they’re doing the opposite today. They penalize business owners like myself. They force a lot of mandated regulatory statutes on us as a business that just become way too burdensome. And as we are going public and we have investors and we have consumers and businesses on the platform, like it’s a poor, it’s a poor act of fiduciary responsibility to remain in a state that’s funding this nonsense. When I could be giving our tax dollars to a state that actually welcomes us and embraces us and isn’t going to use are payroll tax to fund abortions.
Beverly Hallberg:
And just, yeah. And just a, a final couple questions for you that I wanted to ask. I wanna take you back to what you were saying when you started this conversation with me talking about the inception, this idea of what you wanted to build. First part of this question, did you ever expect it to grow to what it is today? And the second part of the question is really for our listeners and for Americans, when you see day in and day out, how people are, businesses are joining your platform, how people are becoming members, any encouragement you can give to us, when we look at something like Pride Month and we think to ourselves, it’s too much. It’s too much. We’re headed in the wrong direction. Do you think we could actually swing the pendulum in the other direction?
Michael Seifert:
I absolutely do. I feel an incredible amount of hope as I look to the future. And I think that it’s really important for people to remember too, that the pendulum swings. It does, it always does. Throughout history, the important thing is that when it swings back our direction we’ve got to hold our ground this time and not give so much so regardless of who the president is. And that’s kinda what I’m speaking of when I mentioned that this pendulum swings. There’s gonna be Republicans in office, there’s gonna be Democrats in office. Although I will say that there are more macro political points that we gotta figure out. If you ever want to see someone other than sort of the establishment elected, again, that’s a conversation for another time. But the pendulum swings politically, culturally, we have to hold our ground because politics is downstream of culture.
The way that we secure a prosperous future for the United States that is rooted in the values that made it so special in the first place is if we do not lose the culture, we cannot let that happen. The political winds may blow, but the culture has to remain anti woke in nature because this woke mind virus that has infiltrated culture fundamentally separates people from each other. It fundamentally throws a cork in the fabric of the United States, and ultimately it thwarts any ability for us to grow and to find alignment and common ground. This woke mind virus will tear our institutions apart and therefore the country apart with it. That said, back to the hope, I’m incredibly hopeful because millions of Americans have awakened to this reality, especially in the last 60 days. And so my encouragement to folks is stay the course. This is a long game.
We’re not going to move everything back our direction and then hold that ground overnight. It takes decades ultimately. But I’m hopeful that if Americans will continue to prioritize the values that have built this great nation and actually vote with their dollars, they will see a new Renaissance era created where manufacturing is brought back to our shores. The right types of small businesses are prospering. The, the values that have built this country are protected in the marketplace. There’s no more DEI and ESG philosophies that are guiding the economy. It goes back to pure shareholder capitalism, prioritizing the quality of their products. That’s the future that we have at hand. If we will stay the course on this because major corporate entities are learning 50 billion in market cap eviscerated from Anheuser-Busch, Disney and Target over the course of the last 60 days.
And we are just getting started. So stay the course. And I am filled with hope. To your first question, I could absolutely have envisioned that this would grow to the degree that it has, but what I could not have imagined is, is that it would happen as fast as it has happened. That blows me away every day. The way that this marketplace is evolving as quickly as it’s evolving is beyond my wildest dreams. But what I will tell folks is that we will become the new Amazon. That is where we are going. And we are really excited to get there with the help of millions of consumers that continue to blow wind in the sales of the parallel economy. We’re building this platform for the people. And as we continue to advance, we’re excited about the new developments to the product and updates that continue to make this e-commerce experience come more alive. And so that we can compete with Amazon at a greater level. But it only happens if we, the people will continue to stand up, make our voices heard with our wallets. And thanks to incredible shows like this. And you’re great listeners, I think we can get there.
Beverly Hallberg:
Well, for our listeners who wanna join you in this, they can type in public sq.com or download the app, a public sq. I think it’s wonderful what you’re doing. Michael Seifer, CEO of Public Square, thank you for what you have built. And also thank you for joining us on She Thinks Today.
Michael Seifert:
Thank you so much for having me,
Beverly Hallberg:
And thank you all for joining us. Before you go, IWF does want you to know that we rely on the generosity of supporters like you. An investment in IWF fuels our efforts to enhance freedom, opportunity, and wellbeing for all Americans. So please consider making a small donation to IWF by visiting iwf.org/donate. That’s iwf.org/donate. Last, if you enjoy this episode of She Thinks do leave us a rating or a review. It does help, and we love it if you share this episode so your friends can know where they can find more She Thinks. From all of us here at IWF, thanks for watching.
